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AntMan
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I need a little advice...

I was driving home from work earlier today and a another driver was driving just a little behind. As we got off a round-about onto a national speed limit dual carriage way I went into the left hand lane (as there was a roundabout coming up ahead that required me to be in this lane in order to go straight on) and accelerated up to 70mph. He got off onto the right hand lane and proceeded to accelerate in order to over take me, I slowed down to 60mph as he came up beside me as I didn't want to race, as he pulled in front he had to slam on his brakes which caused me to go into the back of him (do note it was icy on the road). He says that this was because the car in front put on their brakes hard.

The damage to my car is prodominantly on the right and his on the left (if that helps at all). We've had a chat about how to sort it out but I'm afraid as I'm the one who went into the back of him he's going to try to claim off my insurance despite what we're discussing (I'm hoping to just pay for the damage to our own cars and be done with it).

What do you guys think I should do (in both a professional and personal opinion).

Oh and I'll disclaimer myself:

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Personally? Having worked in insurance before. I would defo inform your insurance company. Put it this way, on paper you went into the back of his car. Without any independent witnesses, you will more than likely be at fault. He could claim for personal injury on top of the damage to his car. If he waits a week or two before doing this and you haven't informed your insurance at the time of the accident they may well void your policy.

But I suppose it comes down to wether or not you trust a complete stranger.

Edited by Young_wanna_be_cop
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I think you'll find you won't get a response as your asking a question that involves an incident you've been involved with and is ongoing. This is scenario city, not a legal forum and like the disclaimer you've mentioned says, no substitute for a solicitor. As has been said write it down or record it somewhere and inform your insurance company in great detail. As this is a non injury accident where both parties have exchanged details it's not really a police matter to sort out and not one you'll find many police officers getting involved in.

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You should of called the police, and got them to attend, as an RTC where damage has been done to both vehicles and potentially personal injury

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You should of called the police, and got them to attend, as an RTC where damage has been done to both vehicles and potentially personal injury

In my force, if there is a damage only RTC between two vehicles, basically caused by snow/ice, then unless the road is blocked or there are allegations of serious offences, then we won't attend unless we are very close by. The drivers will be advised to exchange details, take photos on cameras/phones etc and it will be dealt with by their insurance companies - and to call back if there are any problems with this. If we can attend, then we will (but not on blues/at speed) as we don't want to crash either! We get inundated with very minor RTC's and obviously haven't got the resources to send to each one, or can't physically get to each one. A note is made on the control system of the reg numbers involved in case there are problems later on.

As MrGuf says, it's a non injury, non reportable RTC where details have been exchanged and not one that Police need to attend.

AntMan - You say it was icy on the road, yet admit to doing 60 and 70mph. When he braked sharply, did you slide on ice into him, or was the road surface fine??? As you say, you have driven into the back of him. You won't be able to prove that he had no reason for braking therefore "technically" I would say it's your fault. You should of eased off more to ensure that you had enough space to stop. If the road really was icy, then you shouldn't have been doing 70mph!

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Proving what went on will be difficult, I suspect this will result in a 50/50 liability insurance claim.

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As MrGuf says, it's a non injury, non reportable RTC where details have been exchanged and not one that Police need to

There's a difference between non-reportable and not attended.

Damage caused to a vehicle other than that of the driver = Reportable.

Just because it would be impractical for the police to attend does not mean that it is not reportable even if the response is just to do a PNC check for insurance and say "sort it out with your insurance companies"

Edited by Chill-ie
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There's a difference between non-reportable and not attended.

Damage caused to a vehicle other than that of the driver = Reportable.

Just because it would be impractical for the police to attend does not mean that it is not reportable even if the response is just to do a PNC check for insurance and say "sort it out with your insurance companies"

Section 170 of the Road Traffic Act says that if there is no injury to anyone other than the driver of the (would be V1) vehicle, and details are exchanged between all parties whom have had damage caused (other vehicles, owners of walls/fences etc), then there is no need to report it to Police - as such, a non reportable RTC.

In practice however, most are reported to the Police and the Police will attend and may look into offences of due care etc. In some cases where no offences are apparant, then Police may instruct the parties involved to exchange details and a PNB entry may surfice (check Force Policy to see what your force requires you to do).

If say due to snow/ice etc, the Police are unable to attend a reportable RTC, then arrangements will need to be made for an Officer to speak to the drivers and complete an RTC report at a later date. If they can't attend a non-reportable RTC, then as long as details are exchanged between all parties then no Police action is needed.

Have a look at: http://www.met.police.uk/traffic/forms.htm

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And once again we've been taught incorrect information.

In our training on Reportable RTCs we were instructed that

owing to the presence of a mechanically propelled vehicle on a road or other public place, an accident occurs by which—

(a) personal injury is caused to a person other than the driver of that mechanically propelled vehicle, or

(b)damage is caused—

(i) to a vehicle other than that mechanically propelled vehicle or a trailer drawn by that mechanically propelled vehicle, or

(ii) to an animal other than an animal in or on that mechanically propelled vehicle or a trailer drawn by that mechanically propelled vehicle, or

(iii) to any other property constructed on, fixed to, growing in or otherwise forming part of the land on which the road or place in question is situated or land adjacent to such land.

was reportable RTC and the police MUST be notified by law and insurance produced at police station.

Looks like we were mis-led. I even thought at the time that it seemed too wide and all encompassing of an umbrella as all RTCs in a public place would result in being reportable as damage would occur to something other than the drivers vehicle.

I stand corrected and learning has occured - it is only injury RTCs or non-stop/information not given RTCs that need reporting

Edited by Chill-ie
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Your sort of right - it's also down to the being able to "exchange details". So if you crash into a piece of roadside furniture, wall, fence etc, then you don't know who owns it, then you can't exchange details. This then makes it a reportable RTC.

So...

Fred is driving his car down a road, and collides into the rear of Bill who is stopped at the traffic lights. They both stop, get out and confirm that they are not injured. They then exchange their details. This is "technically" non reportable, however Fred does appear to have committed an offence of due care and Bill may wish the Police to attend to investigate this. If Fred fully admits causing the collision and Bill is happy with that, then he may not wish the Police to attend and is happy for Fred's insurance company to pay out for the damage.

Fred is driving his car down a road, and suddenly realises that Bill in front has stopped at the traffic lights. Fred swerves to avoid colliding with Bill and instead knocks over a road sign. Technically Bill needs to stop as the collision has occured due to the presence of his motor vehicle (i.e. Fred has swerved to avoid hitting him) and they should exchange details (even though Bill's vehicle isn't damaged). Fred can't exchange details with a road sign, and doesn't know who owns it, so it is a reportable RTC and must be notified to the Police as soon as practical. Fred has a mobile phone with him, so should ring the Police there and then to report it. In all likelihood, the Police will then attend.

Fred is driving his car to work and goes a little wide around a sharp bend knocking over a road sign on the grass verge. The sign is damaged, but isn't a danger to other road users. Fred doesn't have his mobile phone on him. He can leave the scene and report it to the Police when practical. In essence, this means as soon as possible so he can't spend all day at work, then go home and call the Police - he should do this when he gets to work. Police will arrange to see him and take an RTC report.

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AntMan - You say it was icy on the road, yet admit to doing 60 and 70mph. When he braked sharply, did you slide on ice into him, or was the road surface fine??? As you say, you have driven into the back of him. You won't be able to prove that he had no reason for braking therefore "technically" I would say it's your fault. You should of eased off more to ensure that you had enough space to stop. If the road really was icy, then you shouldn't have been doing 70mph!

It was a cold icy day however the road was gritted and I felt full traction on the road and therefore thought it safe on that road to continue at that speed. I applied my brakes, the ABS did kick in slightly though not much. My main problem was the fact that I did not have enough room to brake as he was too close.

Thanks for the advice guys. I had decided not to call the police to attend as there was no injuries and no damage other than minor cosmetic damage to the cars. I have since informed my insurance and calculated the speed he must have been travelling in order to have over taken me from the roundabout (all approximates assuming ideal conditions) and can safely say he must have been speeding and that unless he was going at a majorly excessive speed then he could not have had enough time to have over taken me and left suitable breaking distance (which in ideal conditions is approx. 2 seconds).

On another note as a matter of interest there appear to be a lot of conflicting opinions on whether to inform the police or not. I am of the opinion that it would be a waste of the polices time if I had informed them as they would have had to respond to the incident. I mean if no one is hurt and the only damage is to the cars and there is a friendly exchange between the 2 drivers I see no need to notify the police... Am I wrong?

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  • 4 weeks later...
I mean if no one is hurt and the only damage is to the cars and there is a friendly exchange between the 2 drivers I see no need to notify the police... Am I wrong?

Spot on - as long as insurance details were given during the 'friendly exchange' there's no problem.

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Non injury RTCs on the motorway are purely dealt with by us HATOs, the police as a rule dont attend unless we ask them to. Allegations of motoring offences etc. :D

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