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nigeltm

What constitutes "going equipped"?

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nigeltm

The other thread on going equipped reminded me of a conversation I recently had with an associate who is an Officer. Just to be clear I'm not in the Police.

The discussion was around keeping lock knives in the boot of a car as part of a Mountain Rescue kit. I mentioned that I keep a locking Leatherman multitool in my kit and often carry a non-locking, sub 3" Leatherman Kick on my person. Once we had clarified that the Leatherman was allowable under Sect 139 of the CJA 1988 he stated that he would consider me for going equipped instead.

Is this reasonable? My understanding is that going equipped needs to show an intention to commit a crime with the items you are carrying. Simply having an item on you which could be used to commit a crime is not justification in itself.

What do you think?

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Grumpy275

I like you am not a PC. By your own admission you are going equiped to carry out Mountain Rescue. Ask your friend if this was what he meant.

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nigeltm

His position was that the one in the kit was Ok as it was in context. It was the one on my belt he would have a problem with. The usual "why would you need that when shopping in Tescos?" comment was made.

I could see his point if I was carrying pliers, 12" pry bar and a couple of screwdrivers. But a multitool? Addmitedly I don't carry it for work (any more). I carry it for convenience and a bit of "just in case". No scrabbling for a fine screwdriver to tighten my glasses, I've used the long nosed pliers to pull long thorns from my daughter's foot (teach her not to wear sandles when walking in the dunes!) and so on.

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The_Domino

He would have you in for going equipped to steal because you had in your possession a non-locking multitool? Sounds pretty weak to me

Edited by kato

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Fritz@Customs

The usual "why would you need that when shopping in Tescos?" comment was made.

Perhaps if you were skulking behind a jewellers at two in the morning, he might have a point, but I don't see how having a multi-tool in Tesco's would assist you to commit a burglary in any way, shape or form.

It's another example of this current obsession with pointy things that has now resulted in UKBA officers at the frontier being required to report detections of non-seizable knives... that is, we now have to log and report any legal cutlery we come across to our weapons smuggling co-ordinators, even though there's no restriction on bringing it into the country and, therefore, no action we can take against the knives or the importer.

They'll have us reporting aspirin as non-seizable drugs next.

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Sectioned Detection

To cut the security tags off items? I've locked up a guy for going equipped because he had tinfoil on him. Got a conviction too. So whilst you think it would be stupid to arrest for going equipped for being in possession of some items. It all depends on the person, location and situation.

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JohnRich2010

I often have mine in Tesco's, I pop in with it to do my shopping, the same as my phone always goes to the cash machine que with me, it doesn't mean I'm going to try get a HD vid of someones pin and card to clone it. It's with me because it goes everywhere I do, and I am there at the time.

If you have a good reason to be in possession of something, it is still valid and not dependent on you failing to pop into tesco on your way somewhere, which is irrelevant to the validity of the reason, is it not? Unless your there looking dodgy near the clothes section your not that likely to be arrested for going equipped are you?

Also, Tinfoil?? Oh, haha, my mind went blank for a moment trying to think what you would do with tinfoil, for the tags no doubt.

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grinner82

Its any article that can be used in cause or connection with any burglary or theft.

its a matter of discretion, yes you could get locked up for having a mulittool in tesco, or a street corner, park etc. The same as you can get locked up for having a glove on you in summer, its a matter of officer discretion or the circumstances in which you see a person, what they are doing, what explanation they have for having the article on them.

For eg a person walking round a housing estate, in a hot spot area at 0300 hours with a glove on them and they do not live there or account for why they are there will most likely get arrested,

The same person at 1500 hours in their own estate prob would not etc.

but again checks would be made PNC/ Intel to see the persons previous to help inform a decision.

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nigeltm

Thanks for all the input guys. yet again it comes down to context and previous convictions.

On that basis I think I'm pretty much in the clear. While I do carry latex gloves (I'm a first aider) and often a multitool I don't tend to hang around in a suspicious manner (well, not that often :whistle2: )

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Trojan 2132

I don't tend to hang around in a suspicious manner (well, not that often :whistle2: )

You're not still using ''the sheep backed into me'' line? :lol:

Edited by Trojan 2132

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nigeltm

Why Mr. Trojan, I have no idea what you could be alluding to!

I'm a fine upstanding member of the community. I'll have you know that I even work for charity as a member of a south Wales Mountain Rescue team. I spend plenty of time on the hills.

Yes, the Welsh mountains. Lots of hills and cliffs. Beautiful to look at, especially on a fine summer's day when the grass is green and the sheep dot the hillside. Sheep which are often seen backing away from the cliffs and they sometimes stumble ... :shhh:

Edited by nigeltm

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NWest

Sheep and Welsh mountains reminds me of a joke.

Dai and his friend are stood at top of mountain overlooking the valley.

Dai - Do you see that house down there, do they say Dai built that house. Do they fu@k say Dai built that house.

Dai - Do you see that wall down there, do they say Dai built that wall. Do they fu@k say Dai built that wall.

Dai - And see that garage down there, do they say Dai built that garage. Do they fu@k say Dai built that garage.

Dai - One fu@king sheep i shagged!

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JohnRich2010
:clapping: :clapping: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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NWest

Sheep and farmers also reinded me of this.

Panorama doing a program and interviewing farmers on how they make love to their sheep.

Australian says he puts front legs over a wall and back legs in wellies so cant get away.

New Zealander says also puts front legs over a wall and back legs in wellies so cant get away.

Scottish farmer says the same and so does the Welsh.

He asks the English farmer and he says he makes love to his sheep like he does to his wife, in the missionary position.

Interviewer asks him why he doesnt do it like everyone else, front legs over a wall and back legs in wellies so cant get away.

English farmer looks at him in disgust and say "What, and miss out on all that kissing!"

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JohnRich2010
:lol: :lol:

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