Jump to content

Evening standard. Shots fired at undercover police in north London street chase amid growing attacks on officers


Member of public 1

Recommended Posts

Sad to hear that there has been a rise in attacks on officers although I'm not entirely surprised by it. Criminalizing people for meeting friends or having meals together, things that would have been perfectly normal if we didn't have the pandemic, has taken a toll and created a lot of pushback against the authorities who enforce it. While I'm sure that officers like the "I'll just make something up" man is in the minority, videos of heavy handed enforcement like that has created a lot of ill will towards police. While the police will never be universally liked, especially not by criminals, it's worrying me how many "normal" law abiding people are now taking a negative view of how the police are operating. It's like that fundamental good relationship between police and public seems to be frayed, or damaged. Is there anything that could be done to repair that?

Edited by Equin0x
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Equin0x said:

Sad to hear that there has been a rise in attacks on officers although I'm not entirely surprised by it. Criminalizing people for meeting friends or having meals together, things that would have been perfectly normal if we didn't have the pandemic, has taken a toll and created a lot of pushback against the authorities who enforce it. 

Are you genuinely linking OCG activity to Mr and Mrs Miggins being busted for having Miggins Jnr and his girlfriend round for tea contrary to lockdown regulations?  Somehow I don't think Mr Miggins got into such a rage over an £80 FPN that he went on the dark web and hired an Uzi 9mm so that he could try to take out the next under cover cop that he identified.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Equin0x I'm genuinely confused as to why you think the police were being heavy handed in this instance? Either before or after they were shot at? The tone of your post (and many others) implies that the officers in question were somehow at fault for doing their job. Why is this?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Equin0x said:

Sad to hear that there has been a rise in attacks on officers although I'm not entirely surprised by it. Criminalizing people for meeting friends or having meals together, things that would have been perfectly normal if we didn't have the pandemic, has taken a toll and created a lot of pushback against the authorities who enforce it. While I'm sure that officers like the "I'll just make something up" man is in the minority, videos of heavy handed enforcement like that has created a lot of ill will towards police. While the police will never be universally liked, especially not by criminals, it's worrying me how many "normal" law abiding people are now taking a negative view of how the police are operating. It's like that fundamental good relationship between police and public seems to be frayed, or damaged. Is there anything that could be done to repair that?

Are you for real. It is not normal for people to be in possession of a firearm, neither is it normal or, in any way acceptable to discharge a firearm at Police Officers who are just performing their duty.

Instead of criticising the Police for performing their duties, criticise those who feel that it is beneath them to obey the law or to follow regulations to protect the public in the face of a Pandemic.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Zulu 22 said:

Are you for real. It is not normal for people to be in possession of a firearm, neither is it normal or, in any way acceptable to discharge a firearm at Police Officers who are just performing their duty.

Instead of criticising the Police for performing their duties, criticise those who feel that it is beneath them to obey the law or to follow regulations to protect the public in the face of a Pandemic.

I think most people are doing their best to follow regulations and in most cases when they break the rules it's not that they think the rules are beneath them, it's that they have done their best for nearly a year and just need some sense of normality back.

My comment was more of a general criticism on the way officers are enforcing these lockdowns rather than this specific incident. I agree it's not normal for people to have a firearm, or to shoot at an officer. What caught my eye and prompted my comment was the bit about "growing attacks". I have noticed a rise in negativity or hostility towards the police and worryingly it now seems to be coming from people who generally supported you in the past. Billy Burglar has never liked you, but now I'm seeing a rise in the amount of "Mrs Miggins" types who are very critical of officers. The main issue at the min seems to be how you are policing lockdown, people are really struggling to adjust to simple things like meeting friends/having coffee now being illegal and there is a lot of resentment towards the police for criminalizing people who doing things that were perfectly acceptable a year ago. Some of the things we've seen leaked hasn't helped, like threatening to make something up against people although with the amount of criticism I saw that officer getting I'd assume he's the minority. Also appreciate it's not easy for you, you don't make the law. Just feel fed up of the whole thing, the entire year has been miserable and it feels like everybody is on edge. Maybe not the right thread for what I was trying to say.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Need to shoot back a little more often. 
 

I caught a clip of Police Interceptors yesterday where a man came to a door and shot at about 8 armed cops. Not a single shot fired, luckily it was a blank weapon, but can’t help think the current persecution of any cop who does use a firearm is the reason it didn’t end differently 


 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What's the specific process that happens to an officer who shot and killed someone?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, Equin0x said:

I think most people are doing their best to follow regulations and in most cases when they break the rules it's not that they think the rules are beneath them, it's that they have done their best for nearly a year and just need some sense of normality back.

My comment was more of a general criticism on the way officers are enforcing these lockdowns rather than this specific incident. I agree it's not normal for people to have a firearm, or to shoot at an officer. What caught my eye and prompted my comment was the bit about "growing attacks". I have noticed a rise in negativity or hostility towards the police and worryingly it now seems to be coming from people who generally supported you in the past. Billy Burglar has never liked you, but now I'm seeing a rise in the amount of "Mrs Miggins" types who are very critical of officers. The main issue at the min seems to be how you are policing lockdown, people are really struggling to adjust to simple things like meeting friends/having coffee now being illegal and there is a lot of resentment towards the police for criminalizing people who doing things that were perfectly acceptable a year ago. Some of the things we've seen leaked hasn't helped, like threatening to make something up against people although with the amount of criticism I saw that officer getting I'd assume he's the minority. Also appreciate it's not easy for you, you don't make the law. Just feel fed up of the whole thing, the entire year has been miserable and it feels like everybody is on edge. Maybe not the right thread for what I was trying to say.

 

In regards to Policing you seem to everything about nothing, and nothing about everything. How would you know anything about Billy the Burglar. I have know many who had quite a high regard for the Police. Many Criminals see law breaking as a game, of chance which they are prepared to take. Talking to one serious criminal I happened to comment about the recent spate of crime and his reply was "Yes but it is for you to catch us" followed by a wink.

The problem on the streets today come from people who have never known any discipline and have been brought up in a scenario of violence.  In many, many cases that is the only reaction they know.  I can remember the time when a criminal would actually reply "Fair Cop" and this changed over the years so that when you were about to arrest someone the first thought in your mind was to duck.

It does help if you can comment on something out of knowledge but then what do I know.  I would never comment on the work of a Brain Surgeon because I know so very little about that topic.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Zulu 22 said:

In regards to Policing you seem to everything about nothing, and nothing about everything. How would you know anything about Billy the Burglar. I have know many who had quite a high regard for the Police. Many Criminals see law breaking as a game, of chance which they are prepared to take. Talking to one serious criminal I happened to comment about the recent spate of crime and his reply was "Yes but it is for you to catch us" followed by a wink.

The problem on the streets today come from people who have never known any discipline and have been brought up in a scenario of violence.  In many, many cases that is the only reaction they know.  I can remember the time when a criminal would actually reply "Fair Cop" and this changed over the years so that when you were about to arrest someone the first thought in your mind was to duck.

It does help if you can comment on something out of knowledge but then what do I know.  I would never comment on the work of a Brain Surgeon because I know so very little about that topic.

His response was cheeky but he's not technically wrong. For better or for worse, we do operate on the principle of innocent until proven guilty so it is for you to catch him. Lack of discipline I agree can be a problem at times. In your view what could be done about that? One of the many suggestions I've heard on how to address that is a return of national service but not sure if we have the right kind of climate/culture these days for that to work.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Equin0x said:

His response was cheeky but he's not technically wrong. For better or for worse, we do operate on the principle of innocent until proven guilty so it is for you to catch him. Lack of discipline I agree can be a problem at times. In your view what could be done about that? One of the many suggestions I've heard on how to address that is a return of national service but not sure if we have the right kind of climate/culture these days for that to work.

Do you think you could spout anymore clichés? A return to national service, really? A lot of crooks who can get probably a decent score on a bleep test and shoot straight after their time is up. That's really going to help! 🤔

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Equin0x said:

Lack of discipline I agree can be a problem at times. In your view what could be done about that? 

The Police Service is Highly Disciplined but, as in any organisation there can be some who fail. Some discipline offences are committed by very Junior Officers through their lack of experience and naivety.  Diligence leads us to those who are dealt with in a Professional manner.  As other Professions go the Police Service, probably, has less discipline offenders than most.

I am happy to repeat that, in regards to Policing you seem to everything about nothing, and nothing about everything. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, Zulu 22 said:

The Police Service is Highly Disciplined but, as in any organisation there can be some who fail. Some discipline offences are committed by very Junior Officers through their lack of experience and naivety.  Diligence leads us to those who are dealt with in a Professional manner.  As other Professions go the Police Service, probably, has less discipline offenders than most.

I am happy to repeat that, in regards to Policing you seem to everything about nothing, and nothing about everything.

Was referring to lack of discipline in society in general, not in the police. Which I agree, is a disciplined service.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, Father Jack said:

Do you think you could spout anymore clichés? A return to national service, really? A lot of crooks who can get probably a decent score on a bleep test and shoot straight after their time is up. That's really going to help! 🤔

I don't agree with it, mainly for the reasons you've just said, but a lot of people bring that up. The "in my day we had respect, we did our national service" etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Terrible news, but not surprising these days it seems. 

I don't think National Service in the traditional, 50s, Infantry Regiments etc would be much use at all for the nation (the forces have moved on). However, a positive 'time of service' could be an excellent things. Think NCS, Cadets, RNLI, charity shop work, HMCG rescue, retained firefighters, council service etc.

You could have some sort of mandatory 'service time' for e.g. post 13 yr olds and young adults, e.g. students who receive student loan could pay it back with service? Not sure, just ideas.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...