Complaints against officers

[Fedster + 1,307]

Teenager says he was kneed in the stomach by officer, but accepts he did change allegation.

 

By - Ian Weinfass - Police Oracle

2 Comments

 

A constable could lose his job over accusations he administered a knee strike to a teenager unnecessarily and with disproportionate force.

But the teenager admitted changing his story after an initial interview with the police watchdog, a hearing heard today.

Tower Hamlets based PC James Palmer is accused of striking the boy in the stomach with his knee while the teenager, whose name was withheld during proceedings, was being held by two colleagues.

The boy’s mother had called the police after he damaged her television following an argument at home.

The teenager evaded police for 50 minutes, jumping over fences and into different properties.

Eventually he was caught by two plain clothes constables, his hands were cuffed behind his back and he was held.

Two uniformed officers were also in the vicinity when PC James Palmer arrived on the scene, told the teenager to get on the ground and delivered a knee strike. His defence barrister suggested this may have been meant as a distraction blow.

The alleged victim told the misconduct hearing: “As he was running up towards me he was shouting at me to get on the ground. There’s no way I could get on the ground, I was being held by two officers […] No one else ha[d] told me to get on the ground.”

Asked by Ben Brandon, for PC Palmer, if he remembers the officer putting his hands on his shoulders in an attempt to get him to the floor, he replied: “I can just remember him putting his hands on my shoulders so he can knee me in the belly.”

Mr Brandon said: “In your interview it appears to me you were clear you were struck once by a knee." But referred to an interview with the Independent Police Complaints Commission where he said: "He kneed me in the belly three times, he pinned me to the floor"’. The lawyer asked if he remembered saying that.

The teenager, known in the hearing as B, said he didn’t recall it but accepts he did from the records.

Mr Brandon replied: “That’s not right is it? You agree with me. Do you think that you might have been trying to exaggerate what happened to you?”

‘B’ denied trying to deliberately exaggerate, “though at that point I was a bit angry”, he said.

Mr Brandon said: “I’m going to suggest that where you were kneed, the direction of the knee was in the thigh area.”

The teen insisted: “No, it was my belly.”

Asked if he thinks “it is possible the knee was directed towards your thigh but deflected towards your belly”, the boy replied: “It’s possible that could happen, I’m not gonna lie.”

The hearing continues.

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[Reasonable Man + 1,230]

Maybe off post already but there really isn’t anything to say about the case - complaint made, hearing started. We have no idea about the full circumstances so nothing to sensibly comment on. But - Why do (virtually) all of these stories start with ‘accused [officer] risks losing his/her job’?
We don’t see every crime reporter starting their stories with ‘(accused) risks being put in prison.’
It’s just journalistic sensationalisation. Every officer accused of gross misconduct risks losing their job, just like every other worker accused of some serious breach of rules. It doesn’t need to be said every time.
Rant over.

[Fedster + 1,307]

5 minutes ago, Reasonable Man said:

Maybe off post already but there really isn’t anything to say about the case - complaint made, hearing started. We have no idea about the full circumstances so nothing to sensibly comment on. But - Why do (virtually) all of these stories start with ‘accused [officer] risks losing his/her job’?
We don’t see every crime reporter starting their stories with ‘(accused) risks being put in prison.’
It’s just journalistic sensationalisation. Every officer accused of gross misconduct risks losing their job, just like every other worker accused of some serious breach of rules. It doesn’t need to be said every time.
Rant over.

How can it be sensationalist to state the obvious?  Some of these misconduct stories are the most read stories on PO, so clearly people are interested.

[Reasonable Man + 1,230]

How can it be sensationalist to state the obvious?  Some of these misconduct stories are the most read stories on PO, so clearly people are interested.

As you say, it is stating the obvious. That’s my point, why state the obvious? The fact that these stories are popular means people know that officers accused of assault risk losing their jobs - no need to state the bleeding obvious, every single time.

[Zulu 22 + 4,569]

It is all speculative but has anyone here ever tried to knee someone in the stomach. It is a very difficult strike to do. Thigh yes, but anything higher is difficult. You would have to pull their head down and then you would not be able to reach the stomach, just saying. Always helps when a complainant has changed his story from the original version.

The report does not give the age of the boy, but not many boys damage their mothers TV making her call the Police.

[Growley + 2,436]

It is all speculative but has anyone here ever tried to knee someone in the stomach. It is a very difficult strike to do. Thigh yes, but anything higher is difficult. You would have to pull their head down and then you would not be able to reach the stomach, just saying. Always helps when a complainant has changed his story from the original version.
The report does not give the age of the boy, but not many boys damage their mothers TV making her call the Police.

It's difficult if you don't know what you're doing, or do it the god awful way force OST instructors teach it, so yes, I agree it'd be unusual for a PC to do that particular strike unless there's a significant size discrepancy.

[SimonT + 1,185]

The press love stating things!! If you clearly state something that's obvious it becomes important and people wonder why. 

The officer arrived, clearly wearing a hat! 

A hat? Why would he do that, probably an officious type, probably bully etc