Met police firearms

[Fedster + 1,307]

Communities also need to say 'enough is enough'.

The head of London's murder squad says policing alone will not solve the violent crime wave gripping the capital.

Detective Chief Superintendent Richard Wood pledged his officers would be "lawfully audacious" in stopping the bloodshed, but they need communities to "step up and say enough's enough".

So far this year 62 murders have been recorded by the Metropolitan Police, of which 39 involved knives and ten guns.

In the first three months of this year 45 murders were recorded, compared with the first quarter of 2017 when there were 23.

Members of the London Assembly Police and Crime Committee have launched an urgent inquiry into the surge in violence, and called on the Mayor and the Met to "take hold of the situation".

DCS Wood said there was no single solution to the crime wave.

"It's a complicated series of issues - I don't think there's any one answer," he said.

"It's something we're not going to simply police our way out of.

"We need communities to step up and say enough's enough, we need everybody to come together and we just need to make it completely unacceptable for young people to take knives and guns out on the streets.

"It's absolutely heartbreaking when you're talking to a family who have lost their son or daughter.

"We will be lawfully audacious in what we do on behalf of communities to deal with the issue but we won't arrest our way out of this.

"We will do everything we can within the law to bring those responsible to justice but it's bigger than that."

Police estimate that charges have been brought in around 70 per cent of the cases recorded as murder so far this year.

The remaining 30 per cent includes the deaths of Tanesha Melbourne-Blake, 17, Amaan Shakoor, 16, and Abraham Badru, 26, who were all apparently shot by gang members.

DCS Wood denied there was a wall of silence hampering the investigations but acknowledged some witnesses will not come forward.

"We have some people who are reluctant to come forward, for various reasons, they don't want to help the police.

"It could be that they haven't got confidence in the police, we need to never lose sight of that, to make sure that we've got the confidence of young people.

"There are some people who are reluctant to come forward who are perhaps scared themselves because you are talking about some very violent incidents.

"But we need the help from people to solve these crimes and prevent other young people coming to harm."

He said the charge rate is healthy but he wants to convict every person who commits homicide.

"I will never be happy until we solve 100 per cent of murders.

"My colleagues on the homicide command at the moment are under a lot of pressure, they've got a high workload.

"Obviously the number of cases has gone up so they're under more pressure. We will seek to convict every single person who commits a homicide. We won't rest until we do that."

In the past few days, several teenagers have been caught up in violent attacks.

On Tuesday, two teenagers aged 16 and 18 were stabbed in "a large fight" in Hackney, while another victim, in his late teens, was knifed in the leg during the evening rush-hour near Woolwich Arsenal station, south-east London.

Less than two hours earlier, police in west London were called to The Embankment, Twickenham, to a teenager with a non-life threatening stab wound to his arm.

It follows a bank holiday weekend of bloodshed which saw a number of shootings and stabbings.

On Monday, a 17-year-old boy was stabbed when he was ambushed by two masked men riding a moped in Waltham Forest, east London.

The pillion passenger had a gun and fired at the victim but missed. He was taken to hospital but his injuries are not life-threatening.

A 13-year-old boy was an innocent victim as he was shot in the head while walking down the street with his parents in Harrow.

The youngster was hit by shotgun pellets as a 15-year-old was attacked at around 1.15pm on Sunday in High Street, Wealdstone.

Both teenagers suffered non-life threatening injuries, and the younger boy has been released from hospital.

Aspiring architect Rhyhiem Ainsworth Barton was fatally shot in Southwark on Saturday.

The 17-year-old rapper had "so much potential", his mother said as she tearfully told of her "handsome boy".

View On Police Oracle

[Radman + 2,163]

Heard rumours many Met and BTP cops in London are now carrying Tourniquets on duty in case of major incident or being deployed to a stabbing victim with a catastrophic bleed.

 

[SimonT + 1,185]

I assume with the appropriate training. Not sure an ncalt will do it. 

I carry one myself, no training, for personal use only. Knowing the ambulance response times as they are. 

[Ether + 1,401]

21 minutes ago, SimonT said:

I assume with the appropriate training. Not sure an ncalt will do it. 

I carry one myself, no training, for personal use only. Knowing the ambulance response times as they are. 

Training for use or a tourniquet is minimal and quite frankly isn't rocket science.  I would rather someone use it unqualified than not at all. 

[MindTheGap 1,275]

1 hour ago, Radman said:

Heard rumours many Met and BTP cops in London are now carrying Tourniquets on duty in case of major incident or being deployed to a stabbing victim with a catastrophic bleed.

 

Yes, tourniquets and blast dressings/chest seals have been put into the First Aid module and are now in all response cars and are being delivered to each nick. We are also being issued with a bottle cap that creates a shower out of bottles and bottled water for all cars for corrosive substance attacks. I think the kit/pay came from MOPAC, like the inner-London response cars all having Defibs on board.

This will be force-wide as of last month so in your next refresher you'll no doubt get the training and shown the kit.

[SimonT + 1,185]

6 minutes ago, MindTheGap said:

Yes, tourniquets and blast dressings/chest seals have been put into the First Aid module and are now in all response cars and are being delivered to each nick. We are also being issued with a bottle cap that creates a shower out of bottles and bottled water for all cars for corrosive substance attacks. I think the kit/pay came from MOPAC, like the inner-London response cars all having Defibs on board.

This will be force-wide as of last month so in your next refresher you'll no doubt get the training and shown the kit.

Wow that's a lot of kit. We can barely fit our cones in the back. 

I have no problem with is getting good life saving kit, I have pushed for it. As long as we get training.

Because if we do x and the person dies, the iopc are unlikely to say 'it's quite straightforward you don't really need training' they are likely to reach for the manslaughter papers and a 5y investigation. 

[Radman + 2,163]

8 minutes ago, MindTheGap said:

Yes, tourniquets and blast dressings/chest seals have been put into the First Aid module and are now in all response cars and are being delivered to each nick. We are also being issued with a bottle cap that creates a shower out of bottles and bottled water for all cars for corrosive substance attacks. I think the kit/pay came from MOPAC, like the inner-London response cars all having Defibs on board.

This will be force-wide as of last month so in your next refresher you'll no doubt get the training and shown the kit.

I'll believe it when I see it up my way.

We don't have defibs in the cars up our way and the blast dressings haven't showed up yet either.

We need more trauma training in BTP for the type of environment alone putting aside national security concerns that comes with the territory. 

[MindTheGap 1,275]

1 minute ago, SimonT said:

Wow that's a lot of kit. We can barely fit our cones in the back. 

I have no problem with is getting good life saving kit, I have pushed for it. As long as we get training.

Because if we do x and the person dies, the iopc are unlikely to say 'it's quite straightforward you don't really need training' they are likely to reach for the manslaughter papers and a 5y investigation. 

Where you'd have cones we generally have fatality management grab bags (the big orange backpacks you see in BTP cars and vans), so plenty of room for this stuff as it's not exactly space taking. We now have boxes full of water, these bottle caps and the blast/trauma kit. More for the marauding attack scenario than just the violence in the MPD.

[David + 4,981]

3 hours ago, MindTheGap said:

Yes, tourniquets and blast dressings/chest seals have been put into the First Aid module and are now in all response cars and are being delivered to each nick. We are also being issued with a bottle cap that creates a shower out of bottles and bottled water for all cars for corrosive substance attacks. I think the kit/pay came from MOPAC, like the inner-London response cars all having Defibs on board.

What a shocking indictment on the UK in 2018.

[Mac7 808]

What a shocking indictment on the UK in 2018.

Or a force better equipping it’s officers. Just a shame it’s taken headlines to realise officers on the front line need better or enhanced first aid equipment. The training has been there for a while, the kit hasn’t.

[David + 4,981]

5 hours ago, Mac7 said:

Or a force better equipping it’s officers. Just a shame it’s taken headlines to realise officers on the front line need better or enhanced first aid equipment. The training has been there for a while, the kit hasn’t.

I think that rather misses the point. We should be asking ourselves why this kit is necessary in 2018; that's the shocking indictment.

[Phil + 33]

I’ve been trained by the Met in the use of a tourniquet since pre 2012 when the Met first rolled them out to Public Order First Aiders, it’s only in the last 12-18 months that the training has been widen to all officers. The training is simple and the first lesson taught is how to apply it too yourself one handed should the need ever arise. There introducing isn’t because of current knife crime problem but part of a continual development of skills and that they could potentially save a life.

 

The de-fibs were introduced to response vehicles following a trial where the ambulance service would ask for our attendance at cardiac arrests in the first instance if we were free. During the trial a few lives were saved and trial extended. There was even a case were a officer suffered a heart attack following a footchase, officers started CPR and the presence of a De-fib with minutes is said to be the reason he survived, there are now calls for all job cars to carry them for that just in case moment.  

[cookyy2k 536]

On 10/05/2018 at 17:38, MindTheGap said:

with a bottle cap that creates a shower out of bottles and bottled water for all cars for corrosive substance attacks.

The problem with this is they issue cops with these and tell people in the media that if you find a victim of such an attack pour on water without considering what the substance is. There are many corrosive substances that could be used in such an attack that would be made a lot worse by blindly adding water. We've all seen fight club right (and if you haven't, go see it it's good), adding water to lye would have caused serious damage. Another example is concentrated sulphuric acid, add water to that and you'll end up with a load of boiling water (and acid). I'm not sure what is the best way to universally deal with such things with an unknown substance to be fair but water is a pretty poor option in many circumstances.

[JulietAlpha1 + 515]

6 hours ago, cookyy2k said:

The problem with this is they issue cops with these and tell people in the media that if you find a victim of such an attack pour on water without considering what the substance is. There are many corrosive substances that could be used in such an attack that would be made a lot worse by blindly adding water. We've all seen fight club right (and if you haven't, go see it it's good), adding water to lye would have caused serious damage. Another example is concentrated sulphuric acid, add water to that and you'll end up with a load of boiling water (and acid). I'm not sure what is the best way to universally deal with such things with an unknown substance to be fair but water is a pretty poor option in many circumstances.

We had an input from LFB a while a go and they have considered it. You’re not using the water to counteract the acid/alkaline you’re using it to flush off the acid, so you may get some adverse reactions but hopefully most of the reacting will be done on the floor, not on the victim’s skin.

I think they’re also counting on every day easy to obtain acids like bleach etc, rather than concentrated sulphuric acid etc.

[cookyy2k 536]

Just now, JulietAlpha1 said:

We had an input from LFB a while a go and they have considered it. You’re not using the water to counteract the acid/alkaline you’re using it to flush off the acid, so you may get some adverse reactions but hopefully most of the reacting will be done on the floor, not on the victim’s skin.

I think they’re also counting on every day easy to obtain acids like bleach etc, rather than concentrated sulphuric acid etc.

I get that but these reactions are super fast, and again in some cases the addition of water will make it much much worse while not getting rid in nearly as small quantities as people think. Commercially available Bleach is a reasonably dilute alkali (6% sodium hypochlorite) and would have to be on there a reasonable time to leave scaring injuries, leaving industrial bleaches and back to the more industrial acids (it is very, very easy to get conc. Sulphuric acid). From a chemical weapons point of view it's a risky proposition to go in with water without an idea of what you're up against. There are combinations that you can make that will create toxic gasses very quickly after the application of water and while your standard thug wont go to those lengths a terrorist may well do so as a trap for emergency services. A simple test strip would take 5 seconds and give a much better indicator of what to do to prevent further damage much better.