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  1. First and foremost, know that your Thin Blue Line family here in the US stands proud with our blue brothers and sisters in the UK. You've been on the minds of myself and my fellow officers here ever since the news broke. You may know or may have seen our tradition where we shroud our badges with a mourning band after the loss of an officer. Today I have shrouded my badge, in honor of PC Keith Palmer and the life he gave today in the fight against the evil in this world. Let us not forget Keith and all those who run towards danger while everyone else is running away. On that note I raise a glass to our fellow officers that ran towards terror today. For those that ended the threat and those that worked to help the injured and restore peace and security, great job. "And maybe remind the few, if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stands, between the monsters and the weak"
  2. I have thought long and hard about posting this , and mods if you're not happy feel free to edit or even delete it There has been debate on here recently about how policing and the polices attitudes have changed and not for the best. It occurred to me that a lot of my service ( albeit as a ' hobby bobby ', but one who was valued, took notice and was one of the team) was over the period being discussed,and I got to wondering were things really that much better in the not so distant past Certanly in the glory days before savage cutbacks the officer numbers were much better,but I would want to look at less concrete issues than that. Definitely IMHO there were things that were better. The police had more autonomy and were able to use their common sense more, there wasn't the worry that making a simple mistake could lead to months or years of worrying or even the loss of a job. The 'ways and means act ' was often used and did achieve results. So far so good (old days) but were things so much better in the bigger picture? I experienced sexism and sexual remarks,and saw racism. Homophobia was rife .Some of the stories I heard of things that happened would have made PSDs hair stand on end ,there is a chance that some of this was bobbies 'bigging themselves up' to a young woman , but even then ,some things I did see would induce apoplexy today i.e. drinking on duty, married officers visiting their mistress(es) during the shift etc Reference was made to a 'can't be bothered ' attitude today well back then a call to an ASB job within quarter of an hour of finishing time could result in a response of 'area searched no trace ' or a warp speed drive past. Male victims of domestic abuse were considered wimps who needed to grow a pair. The attitude to sexual crime could be victim blaming to say the least As for CID. They were a law unto themselves, I could make another post just about them ( Gene Hunt wasn't that big a caricature) And yet I bl@@dy loved it But I didn't know better Where they the good old days? No they were different
  3. Some photos I edited and mashed together...
  4. A couple of observations: Metropolitan Police - RESPECT IPCC - I will save you a lot of time investigating the shooting of the assailant and producing a report. Just make a quick public statement - THE POLICE OFFICERS INVOLVED ARE HEROES Home Office - Wake up and smell the coffee
  5. I think you should have a bit more respect for the hundreds of thousands of police officers who came before you - what makes you special enough to denigrate all their service for a cheap snub?
  6. I think some people are a bit confused here. Either the officer committed offences or he didn't. His bedside manner in doing so is a conduct issue not a criminal one. He wasn't charged with possession of a bladed article whilst being uncivil.
  7. Policing is strange across Europe. The Dutch it is acceptable to blindfold prisoners, particularly high risk ones, yet no spit hoods in the UK because it's considered inhumane. In Germany you can fire warning shots if a suspect is running away and a reserve officer can be issued a firearm following a couple of evenings of training at the local station, yet British police arent trustworthy. There's some forces in Europe where officers are issued a combat knife but a officer here with a pen knife gets charged with offensive weapons. In Spain officers use Cs spray to clear the streets to get revelers to return to their hotels. Water cannons are mainstream methods of riot control. Yet British police endure going toe to toe with often violent people and have to suck it up when bricks come flying and patrol cars burned. First minute an officer raises a baton and you can't see for camera flashes. Sent from my D2303 using Tapatalk
  8. Is it really so far fetched for some people that an emergency service worker might need a multi-tool for a relevant emergency/general policing purpose? RTCs, deaths, first aid, re-securing properties. Yes, some things are probably not supposed to be done by officers, such as re-securing property, but we all know that it happens. There is a genuine likelihood that an officer may have to go to a hanging and cut somebody down. It might not happen everyday, but it's more than likely that at some point we'll have to. Any how would any of us feel if we made it to a suicide attempt in time but failed to save the person because we couldn't cut them down and start first aid? Who's going to get dragged through the DPS, IPCC, Coroner's Court etc. having to explain why they coulda/shoulda/woulda saved someone if they'd had the equipment. Who will be considered to have failed the person who died? Who will potentially have to live with that guilt? How much kit do various forces fail to provide their officers with? The Met doesn't issue: boots, torches, hand sanitiser, slash/prick proof gloves. Do we just refuse to buy the stuff we need? "I can't search that field sergeant, it's dark and I don't have a torch?" That would go down like a lead balloon! Some forces do issue this kit and good on them, but don't tell me that 'the job issues you what you need,' because I can tell you that they don't. The simple fact is this job is carried by people who do more than expected, buy equipment that is needed, go above and beyond on a regular basis and the job is laughing, until it all goes wrong. Then you're on your own. It can be guaranteed now that if officers did try to make a case for allowing/issuing multi-tools, the first argument from SLT will be, "No, you'll use it to saw through windscreens..."
  9. Given the recent examples around these sort of issues - e.g. HT officers getting refs at McDonalds, an officer getting stuck on for misconduct for not administering a breathalyser at an RTC, officers being stuck on in TVP for not closing a road due to ice, etc - can you honestly say that you're surprised? Quite frankly, I come to work to do my best, to serve the public and to try and help people and so do the majority of other officers that I know. But, it seems like it's a full time job just trying to cover my own back every day these days, let alone trying to do things like catch criminals or help those in need. Police officers are humans, not super human. We will make mistakes and do things wrong. In those circumstances, people can and should be taken aside, given advice, given training and learning and development opportunities to address what went wrong. Why we need to crucify everybody and try and throw them all out of the job is beyond me......
  10. For me this just reinforces that bobbies in the big cities need arming. Now. No one knows exactly what has happened today and it isn't appropriate to speculate with "what's ifs", but this can't be allowed to happen again. Sent from my SM-G930F using the Police Community App
  11. The thin blue line recognises a hero. May he find peace and his family comfort. Sent from my D2303 using Tapatalk
  12. Terrible news but we need to wait for the full facts, or as full as we will ever know. Police Officer's are a special breed, they go to work every day not knowing what it will hold. Condolences to all the victims and their familie. Ecept for the oone who was not a victim.
  13. As others were rushing away from the incident MP Tobias Ellwood ran towards it to administer first aid to the police officer. The police are not the only heroes today. 'Hero' MP Tobias Ellwood tried to save stabbed officer http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39359319
  14. That wouldn't happen as in jury selection the court outlines the case including the location, the parties involved and the witnesses whose evidence will be used and the potential jurors are told to declare any interest or if they know any of the key parties involved in the case.
  15. You always get told to be ready and know that it may happen but when it does you don't expect it. I cannot say how proud and thankful I am for all the emergency services. I have been out for some time after the incidents and for sure have seen the increase in visible police presence. Any Officers working tonight, all the best and good luck. It just shows you why practicing and training happens! Rest in Peace for anyone who has passed away.
  16. Thoughts are with all those affected by this coward, huge respect to the officers at the scene and the officer who tragically past away... they saved many more lives from the lunatic.
  17. The Thin Blue Line a Little Thinner Today
  18. News reports cannot be trusted at such an early stage, however all indications are that an officer has been stabbed by a male they challenged. I hope these reports are wrong but I fear not. My prayers are with those who have been attacked by this scum.
  19. Okay so one - it was, and as far as I know still is, a standing order in the Metropolis that officers will carry a torch in the hours of darkness. Yet currently one is not issued. So the policy on not carrying non-issue equipment is fatally flawed on at least one count - if it exists. I'm not convinced by 'Told on OST' means anything unless it's written down. Secondly, people saying they would use a safety knife or a pair of scissors and so on - you are still carrying a bladed article in a public place and so the same legal argument comes into play. How about a screwdriver in your kit bag/boot of your patrol car? Same legislation. Literally the only thing that is legally safe is a folding pocket knife with a less than 3" blade - but if you're going to use it in a hurry with shaky adrenaline hands be ready to fold it in on yourself and cut your fingers! Mines staying on my belt. I have faith that this charge will fail or if it succeeds...it will be clarified on appeal as it is a real absurdity.
  20. The majority of Met public order deployments appear to utilise mainly L3 tactics - whether the officers are trained as L2 or dressed in Code 2 doesn't change the particular tasks. L3 tactics are not difficult and are very basic. Form a line. Stop people passing you. Go where your Sgt tells you too. Keep an eye out for flash points. Look out for injured/vulnerable people. Keep an eye on the person to your left and to your right. They are a low level skill and taught to every recruit now. L2 officers, as I said, mainly utilise L3 tactics but by nature of their training and higher number of deployments/deployments in the higher risk areas tend to be more 'natural' at implementing the L3 tactics. In terms of peaceful protest/event policing (which seems to be a large commitment in the Met) L2 public order is not a technical skill and should be achievable by most confident, fit, disciplined police officers and does not require you to be a great thinker, thieftaker or detective. In the Met at least, L1 officers use in the main a blend of L3 and L2 tactics but are placed in the higher risk areas. They tend to only put boots on the ground when things have started to take a turn for the worse. Due to their regular training and deployments they are more natural and effective at L3 and L2 tactics at protests/events. Where I disagree with the idea that L2 does not require skills or 'a bit more' than your average beat cop is when it comes to the other stuff - and from personal conversations, prior knowledge and this thread I fully accept that this will be a cultural difference between forces as L2 in the Met seems quite a strictly defined role and set of training. I think where L2 officers really have to show individual skill is dynamic deployments on area. Often on area, outside the relative safety of a pre-planned operational order, we as L2 can work with no senior command structure on the ground. It's pot luck whether you even have a public order trained Sergeant at scene and sometimes it's not practicable to await a TacAd. Several times in the past 6 months we have self deployed - one of us has called up and asked for all on duty L2 officers to respond to their location with kit. Then the Sergeant was notified and requested to attend. Once we have assembled at the scene, angry man barricaded in a house/large group of travellers smashing up a licenced premises etc, we have between ourselves conducted a briefing and discussion of contingency tactics whilst awaiting the Sergeant. On the Sergeants arrival he has been briefed with the circumstances, contingencies and current options. That requires a certain amount of skill and thought process which not everyone possesses. The next area which is skilled is MoE, though I have my own doubts as to how in depth my new forces MoE input is as it is incorporated into the L2 initial course. However, my MoE training which goes hand in hand with L2 for rapid entries/building clearances and so on, covered target recce, health and safety planning, Intel development, operational plan production including accurate diagrams, contingencies and briefings...as well as how to smash and drill things to break them! That is a technical skill, especially with MoE expanding from less/non destructive (mica/drilling and so on) and wholly destructive entry techniques (hydraulic rams/reciprocating saws etc). Those who are not MoE all think 'well that's easy I could do that' - some could but it takes a bit more than just your basic cop - which is why I am opposed to a plan for MoE to be rolled out as basic training for recruits. Football policing is another L2 area which depending upon your force/tactics which can require skills. If you work a static post then it is just like any other large event. But when you are in the ground there is alot more to it that takes lots of deployments to become confident. Sometimes the lower league clubs can actually provide more difficult challenges than premier leage clubs because forces can't afford to throw 2/3 PSUs at a match. Part of the requirements of the role are not skill per se in the same way as for say firearms or mounted department... But a requirement as to the officer themselves. Just as I cannot say that I am suited to a role as a Schools Officer there are police officers who should venture into public order. As for probationers with L2...I was one. But I had 5 years of PCSO and Special background so I wasn't walking round still finding my authority and watching my reflection in shop windows. I think a moratorium on all probationers would be wrong but nor should it be the norm.
  21. A locking blade is a safety feature as much as anything else, good luck to anyone hacking away at something in a situation where the adrenaline is flowing without it. The restrictions on them in this country are bonkers. If you're going to stab somebody you wouldn't pick a Leatherman with a small locking blade for instance...
  22. My heart bleeds purple p***! With any luck, he died in excruciating pain.
  23. The rules exist to prevent a thankfully very small number of people from a very small number of police officers. Hearing some of the examples cited here as inappropriate does nothing but dilute and trivialise the serious cases of abuse of power for sexual gain, as well as insult adults who have the freedom to make choices but are labelled effectively as some sort of moron who can't enjoy a relationship without the say so of the state.
  24. They were different and occasionally my toes curl at remembering some of the practice. The crazy things you did wearing a tunic, heavy wool trousers, and piece of wood to fight of all the ills of the world (women in skirts only and a handbag). Yobs throw bricks, our response, pick up a bin lid. No traffic unit available to attend RTA on a busy road at night, stand in the carriageway wearing all black (if the cars can't see you they can't hit you - Not). You're right Pathca they weren't better just very different. Funny though I would still join the job as it was then, but I wouldn't join it now. I do remember being in so many scrapes and being asked by members of the public If I want help. Perhaps the job is the same, just society/community is very very different.
  25. I think what's being missed here is that Cambs are NOT setting up their own plane. They are losing helicopter coverage which was already having to come from NPAS in Norfolk. NPAS will apparently be basing all fixed wing aircraft centrally and by their estimations (which we know from the last '20 minute.' falsehood to be a lie) still only provides 80% of the helicopters capability but with longer range. I think we can mostly agree the majority of air support deployments are time sensitive for them getting to scene rather than longevity of flight. This is a cost cutting measure in the main and yet again our air support capability is cut. NPAS is a joke. The pilots and crew say it, I say it...but the top brass keep lying and people keep lapping up the lies. Edit to add... NPAS fixed wing site is Doncaster. So allowing for passing the job, authorisation, pre-flight drills, take off, reaching cruise speed, flight paths etc I'd guess from request to arriving at Cambridge would be an hour easily. So don't expect planes to be chasing criminals through Cambridgeshire too soon... I guess for the plane to reach us in sunny Kent would be another 20-25 minutes on top. So short of a pre-planned operation I doubt I'll ever see one.
  26. Easier said than done sometimes...
  27. Whilst according to CoP PIP guidance you are correct I think compartmentalising that misses the point. Investigation quality can often be dictated by resources and time. A CID officer provides a better investigation because for the robbery he has the time to conduct a victim profile. He completes a map of the victims route. He completes a CCTV trawl of that route, seizes the footage and views it. This provides a vehicle registration which leads to a suspect. The CID circulate the suspect for arrest by response. Once the prisoner is in custody the CID conduct several interviews. Having seized the suspects phone they manage to conduct cell site analysis placing the suspect at the scene of the robbery. Matching ANPR data with cell site data the detective discovers that the suspect is placed at 4 recent robberies with similar MOs. After some financial investigation the CID officer discovers a business lockup registered to the suspect and swears out a pace warrant. Response execute the warrant with the tactical team and numerous exhibits are located. The job ends up going cross border and after a lengthy investigation they secure a 10 year prison sentence and clear up 5 robberies. The response PC picks up his 15th crime in his pot. This is a robbery with no injury. The PC has several hate crimes in his pot and 2 domestics which take precedence let alone the call demand from 999. The PC gets a quick MG11 from the Ip. The PC emails the local authority CCTV and they haven't got footage of the offence. The PC then goes to more 999 calls and picks up another two jobs in his pot. The next day he goes to a 136 job and is tied up all day. The next day is a constant obs on custody. The next day the officer is the diary car and picks up another 3 crimes. The officer then goes on rest days. On his first day back he is prisoner processor for the day. A week has passed. He dips back into the robbery. He fires off an email to Intel and they throw a name into the hat. The PC can't find anything in his crime report to link the suspect. He submits a crime filing report to his Sgt. He then goes to his next job of the day. He asks for time to work on his crimes the next day and files yet more crimes as undetected with his Sgt bringing him back down to 15 crimes in the pot. Of course the investigative options are open to both - DC doesn't have extra powers to the PC but the role difference dictates a wholesale different investigation and to suggest otherwise is a fallacy (in many county forces anyway).
  28. @MerseyLLB I think you sum this up quite nicely.... spot on with the issue about more boots on the ground. More response officers mean better initial investigations and better handover packages, which will help CID in the long run. It means those officers who want to get released move on to CID can and will and it means that uniformed officers carrying crimes will have more time to investigate them because there are other people to help answer the immediate calls. More police officers is ultimately what is needed to help address the problem at all levels. I'm not sure financial remuneration is the key to solving the issue.... because then firearms officers will want it for their specialist skills, then traffic will want it, then response will say that their skill is being jack of all trades and will want it.... then everyone will get it.
  29. On my old borough CID got the lion's share of the overtime. They also got a whole lot more time at home on weekends than response team. It's a specialist role in a sense, but barely. It's more of a straight swap; one generalist uniform role for a generalist non-uniform one. Don't get me wrong, I can see why it's an unattractive role in the current state of things, I just don't think paying DCs more is necessarily fair on the response team PCs who have to maintain a multitude of equally challenging skill sets for even less recognition.
  30. I agree but an unarmed officer is dead and it is impossible to say until the investigation is concluded whether being armed would have made a difference to the outcome for this brave officer. What I will say, as someone who has opposed the routine arming of police officers, is that my arguments for not doing so seem to become less relevant with each passing tragedy. Getting back on track a brave officer faced up to terror and paid the ultimate price carrying nothing more than a short metal staff and a can of noxious substance. I hope in memory of PC Keith Palmer and recognising his bravery, he is awarded a gallantry medal, along with those officers who ran into danger without a second thought for their own safety and impact on their family, should it go wrong.
  31. The Deputy Commissioner glossed over the question as to whether PC Palmer was armed or not. If he wasnt armed then serious questions need to be asked.
  32. Police officer killed in today's incident named as PC Keith Palmer, age 48. R.I.P. Total of five dead (including the attacker) and 40 injured.
  33. It brings a tear to my eye, I am devastated at the murder of these innocent people and the injuries to to the children. It's horrific and I feel a part of myself goes out to all of them. Whatever monstrosities come our way we will stand together and fight for the continued freedom of this nation and it's people. We will continue to police. We will continue to keep each other safe. This incident does nothing but strengthen our will to stand firm against the terror and darkness. RIP Sent from my D2303 using Tapatalk
  34. I'm also a Kent officer, and I'm pretty happy with our kit if I'm honest. The vast majority of my team wear their numbered epaulettes, our kit is standardised and it looks pretty smart- I genuinely don't think I've heard any serious grumbles with it from an officer. None of us really have bulled boots, but there isn't a single PC on my station that has nasty, filthy or tatty boots. If I'm honest, I really don't agree with this shirt and tie malarkey. When I started as a special, we (as a force) were in the process of phasing out white shirts for operational staff, only retaining them for custody officers and office-bound PCs. The black wicking kit is fit for purpose, comfortable and smart. I might be being a bit trite, but I think the vast majority of officer approachability rests with the officers themselves, rather than their kit. I've spoken to a a few people outside the job about approachability, and not one has said that our kit makes us unapproachable. Personally, I feel that using uniform as a scapegoat for unapproachability is just that- a scapegoat. If an officer is routinely having issues with public interaction, I would suggest taking a look at their behaviour as opposed to their kit in all honesty. I've never had an issue with interaction whatsoever, and I'd like to think that my colleagues would say that I'm about as approachable as it's appropriate to be. The fact that my uniform is all black and lacks a tie, frankly, has never caused me an issue.
  35. The same reason why so many people finish their probation who really shouldn't.
  36. He has been charged with possessing a bladed article meaning that they are suggesting he had no lawful authority for possessing it, full stop. He wasn't charged with being a plonker with a bladed article, whether he was or not I don't know because I don't watch such videos. The same way an officer who strikes someone with a baton whilst on duty unlawfully will quite rightly be charged with assault, they will not be charged with possessing an offensive weapon because at the material time that officer had lawful authority to possess the baton, regardless of whether they used it lawfully or not. Therefore if you're all suggesting that he's been charged with possession based purely on his actions with the rescue blade you need to rethink that view and look at the points to prove for the offence because that is exactly what the CPS would've considered before charging that offence because they know this will set a precedent. Indeed it's a defence specified under this legislation that a person can have a bladed article for use in their work quite legitimately and they've clearly summed up all the evidence including the officers' reason for having it and decided it isn't a legitimate reason that gives him lawful authority to carry it. We'll see in time if the courts agree. Put yourself in his position during interview, what reasonable excuse can you give for carrying a big knife like that? How many windscreens do you need to cut through on a daily basis? I've never known anyone do it, we call Trumpton for that. 'Just in case' isn't a reasonable excuse either otherwise I'd be entitled to carry an AK-47 because Daesh has declared all officials of western states legitimate targets for terrorist murderers! Ultimately anyone ignoring the sage advice in this thread not to carry anything that isn't issued by their force runs the risk of ending up like this officer. If you're alright with that then crack on. Although this officer may not be found guilty at court by way of the criminal burden of proof he will be run through disciplinary processes and on the balance of probabilities he will be incredibly lucky to keep his job. You make your bed and you lay in it, as the saying goes.
  37. Perhaps I've just been unlucky, but I have never seen a seatbelt cutter inside a Police vehicle. It's the sort of thing I'd expect traffic to have, and that's about it. The two situations you've outlined are not remotely analogous. We're not talking about lawful authority, we're talking about good reason - the particular good reason in mention, 'for use at work' is even specifically outlined in the law. Your fantastical tale about a soldier changing his firearm is meaningless rhetoric.
  38. The MPS appears to run a two tier system. On the one hand ERPT's who do the bulk of response work are denied courses because X% are trained and you've had your allocation. Yet look at the gun club and every single one has to be advanced car. I don't see why, apart from they have more support from up above to give them everything that they desire.
  39. Possibly because people think he's in the wrong? Do I think he could have dealt with this situation better based on the information available? Yes. Do I think he should be thrown under the bus and convicted of a number of offences and probably lose his job? No. Training and management advice is what is needed here, possibly a written warning. Not a prosecution. I may be completely wrong and his actions were fully justified. In which case I hope it all comes out in the wash and the charges are either dropped or he is acquitted at Court. We shall have to see. All I know is that watching that video makes me feel uneasy.
  40. Having specialists being paid more than their supervisors isn't uncommon. In previous jobs I have earned more than my managers because of a specialist skill set. I also managed head teachers who earned more than I did. Within social work senior practitioners can earn nearly as much as their team manager, their pay scales cut across the grade of their manager. Although they don't manage people their level of decision making in respect of their particular complex caseload is equivalent to managers. They are able to peer review and carryout particular development activities and work in an advisory capacity.
  41. I think you're looking at things a bit simplistically, Policey_Man. I've never been to Orly, let alone France, but if it's a major airport then you will have thousands upon thousands of people at anyone time milling around and any one individual coming to light to any other individual is going to be pretty slim. Also, how much time had passed since the initial shooting for those at the airport to be even aware of - details, face photo being circulated, anything?
  42. Here's an idea; how about we organise a payment of say, £2-3K a year for officers who are at the top of their pay scale, and demonstrate that they are of a particular level of competence, or hold a particular set of specialist skills. We could even call it something like, I don't know, competency-related threshold payments? On second thought, nah, that's a daft idea. Whoever would run with that eh?
  43. They can circle you know! Not sure about more advanced but aircraft like that used by the PSNI can have two observers instead of the one in a helicopter.
  44. Surely with reduced numbers there needs to be a better allocation of resources and a more equal availability of skills. Especially in the Met, every course is 'earned' either by hard work or time served and it would make sense for all officers to be response, taser, MOE and Level 2 etc, so that no matter what call comes in there's a suitably skilled unit to deal. At the moment we regularly put out 'taser pandas' because there aren't enough taser drivers to staff taser response vehicles. Very often we'll only have X amount of response vehicles and far more pandas because of there aren't enough drivers when people are abstracted / on leave. There are about 10 area car drivers on our borough sitting in office jobs. They left team because of changes to the shift pattern mostly which is understandable. Vote with your feet and all that. There are now fewer Advanced drivers on response team than not on response team and we don't get allocated any courses because, statistically, we've got loads of drivers. Purely from a resourcing point of view either these officers need to hand in their tickets so we can be allocated more, or they need to be posted back where their skills are best used by the organisation. Of course this then creates its own problems because there's no progression for anybody. If you start accumulating driving courses then you'll be stuck on response for ever and a day and if you hand your ticket in you've given up a skill set that you've probably spent a lot of your career working towards. If all these drivers return to response team then there's a void that needs to be filled by non-drivers where there are limited progression options and then you've got a load of people none of whom want to work where they're posted and on and on it goes. If every officer was Level 2 there would be fewer personal abstractions, which is a bug bear of officers: 'I don't want to be L2 because I'll always get used for AID.' If everyone is trained it increases the resource pool meaning individuals get used less often. Plus everyone then gets their £50 a year PO bonus! So, in summary, wider range of courses for everyone to balance skill sets so we become a more efficient workforce!
  45. I sincerely hope that this is rewarded financially. Social work, teaching, and nursing have similar advanced practitioner roles, dealing with the more complex cases without management responsibility and it generally works, but also they are also paid an extra amount, normally around £5,000 pa.
  46. Ok I' m on response so I do get the anti social allowance (but working shifts has its problems) however I don't get overtime either, I get pointless requests from CPS as well and I do have a ridiculous workload (up to 20 crimes) to manage as well as respond. Worst of all I have jobs that should sit with CID (child porn /burgs/ complex frauds etc) but they "don't have capacity" (have I?).
  47. It'll fail at court. Though I'll now be leaving my leatherman at home from now on. No more re-securing doors to save Mrs Miggins the cost of repair or cutting down suicidal people hanging themselves (sadly now into double figures).
  48. The true depth of being a DC isn't just the number of CR's on your case load though. If that were the case I'd be sat around tossing it off half the time because I'm carrying the same number of jobs that I did in response, roughly. It's the level and scope of the crimes. You've got all manner of things to consider and justify doing or not doing over a more straightforward crime. Suspects and victims all over the country or even abroad, complex suspect interviews or ABE interviews that can last hours and run into days. I spent two days last week doing house to house for a robbery where I'd have spent an hour at most on response because the stakes are higher now and results are demanded of me. There's no quick outcome 18's! There's sitting and going through hundreds of thousands of messages, photos and videos looking for that one thing that will get CPS to authorise a charge. Don't get me wrong, response is equally as challenging in a different way. Indeed I left response to be a DC because I was failing my victims by not being allowed time to deal with their crimes effectively and I didn't like it. But CID deserves a small extra payment just for the sheer fact that you can be called in on any day off to deal with a prisoner you've circulated or because CPS have an "urgent" enquiry for you and you're pretty much compelled to go on and do it. There are many other skills that require extra remuneration as well like being a tutor and in time I'm sure there will be a case for that too.
  49. Who said otherwise? I'm struggling to see the relevance of your post, outside of you trying to tell us ever so subtly that you've been on the advanced course.